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[puredyne] A New Install

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Julian Brooks Julian Brooks
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[puredyne] A New Install

"Just some ideas for different future ways to share
common aims and efforts...."

Yes indeed, which is precisely what we could do with atm.

And as dope as that looks, tbh my immediate thoughts are with having a fresh install.  Though I'm sure there must be more of us who have been running Puredyne as our main install and are unsure where to go next, I'm also presuming that there are others who are also thinking that any other ready made OS will seem like a step backwards from what we've had already.  If I'd wanted to have a different distro I would have shifted to that already!

So the general vibe is with building on debian: which one and how basic can we get to have that custom feel yet contains enough 'stuff' to get going?

Obviously going to need a realtime kernel.  Are there really decent benefits from rolling your own to fit your own machine?  And again if so - how?

Personally I would be well chuffed to have a lappy where pretty much everything is compiled and tweeked for my machine.  Not sure how big the performance gains would be but personal satisfaction-wise it would be sizeable.

And then to be able to clone that as a system restore whilst having learnt how to make custom live-iso's for whatever reason (family, friends, community, work, etc.) would be a really useful skill to share.

Onwards eh,

Julian

 


On 7 February 2012 23:47, Andy Farnell <[hidden email]> wrote:

This side of Debian has always impressed me

http://live-build.debian.net/cgi-bin/live-build

Rather than a project that attempts to create and maintain
a one-size-fits-all "distribution" I believe the future
for software that supports groups like this is that
they become a "knowledge base" with a pick-and-mix
set of frequently desired features or configurations
that can move forward independently of the host base
system. This is different from the downstream model
with backporting etc, in that it abandons the attempt to
preserve a definitive version. For 64Studio, Daniel James
and Free Ekanayaka adopted a powerful model based around
PDK (shares some ideas with builders like Broth)
with a concept of different blendable "channels".

Another advantage is that the base Debian doesnt have
to be downloaded every time and doesnt need to be hosted
by the team, its just a channel (package repo and rules for
blending). Going back to the root of Debian frees the project
from policies and decisions downstream at Ubuntu.

Just some ideas for different future ways to share
common aims and efforts....




On Tue, Feb 07, 2012 at 06:28:11PM -0500, Dave Britton wrote:
> I've recently been struggling with carrot and coriander's limited
> life support from being karmic-based, so a long-term support
> distribution would be fine with me, I'd vote for Debian or Ubuntu
> just because I know it more and like the packaging system. The most
> important aspect of puredyne for me is the real-time kernel
> implementation, so I may have to just learn how to roll a linux
> distro myself to get the latest RT. I'm working in Supercollider,
> not pd, and I need jack and alsa to work well. I'd be happy to learn
> more about broth, and the intricacies of packaging in general, and
> help where I can.
>
> I also want to go on record thanking Aymeric and the rest of the
> team for bringing a great concept to reality and supporting its
> development for as long and well as you have. puredyne has helped me
> a lot!
> -Dave
>
> On 02/07/2012 09:07 PM, Julian Brooks wrote:
> >>>Erm, now what?
> >>>
> >>>What is the general consensus of where to go next...
> >>>
> >>>I'm guessing that people are thinking of building on top of a minimal
> >>>debian type thing?
> >>+1 for Debian :)
>
> ---
> [hidden email]
> http://identi.ca/group/puredyne
> irc://irc.goto10.org/puredyne
---
[hidden email]
http://identi.ca/group/puredyne
irc://irc.goto10.org/puredyne


---
[hidden email]
http://identi.ca/group/puredyne
irc://irc.goto10.org/puredyne
Damaru Damaru
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Re: [puredyne] A New Install

For me I just did a fresh debian stable install - still strugling to
install fluxus though.

on my other mahcine I am using #! (crunchbang) which is quite minimal
and fast! (running mixxx on a eeepc 701!!)

would love to contribute on a flexible loose distro based on debian and
or a centralized information center for computational art / floss art os




On 08.02.2012 11:35, Julian Brooks wrote:

> "Just some ideas for different future ways to share
>  common aims and efforts...."
>
> Yes indeed, which is precisely what we could do with atm.
>
> And as dope as that looks, tbh my immediate thoughts are with having
> a fresh install.  Though I'm sure there must be more of us who have
> been running Puredyne as our main install and are unsure where to go
> next, I'm also presuming that there are others who are also thinking
> that any other ready made OS will seem like a step backwards from
> what
> we've had already.  If I'd wanted to have a different distro I would
> have shifted to that already!
>
> So the general vibe is with building on debian: which one and how
> basic can we get to have that custom feel yet contains enough 'stuff'
> to get going?
>
> Obviously going to need a realtime kernel.  Are there really decent
> benefits from rolling your own to fit your own machine?  And again if
> so - how?
>
> Personally I would be well chuffed to have a lappy where pretty much
> everything is compiled and tweeked for my machine.  Not sure how big
> the performance gains would be but personal satisfaction-wise it
> would
> be sizeable.
>
> And then to be able to clone that as a system restore whilst having
> learnt how to make custom live-iso's for whatever reason (family,
> friends, community, work, etc.) would be a really useful skill to
> share.
>
>  Onwards eh,
>
> Julian
>
>  
>
> On 7 February 2012 23:47, Andy Farnell  wrote:
>
>> This side of Debian has always impressed me
>>
>> http://live-build.debian.net/cgi-bin/live-build [1]
>>
>> Rather than a project that attempts to create and maintain
>> a one-size-fits-all "distribution" I believe the future
>> for software that supports groups like this is that
>> they become a "knowledge base" with a pick-and-mix
>> set of frequently desired features or configurations
>> that can move forward independently of the host base
>> system. This is different from the downstream model
>> with backporting etc, in that it abandons the attempt to
>> preserve a definitive version. For 64Studio, Daniel James
>> and Free Ekanayaka adopted a powerful model based around
>> PDK (shares some ideas with builders like Broth)
>> with a concept of different blendable "channels".
>>
>> Another advantage is that the base Debian doesnt have
>> to be downloaded every time and doesnt need to be hosted
>> by the team, its just a channel (package repo and rules for
>> blending). Going back to the root of Debian frees the project
>> from policies and decisions downstream at Ubuntu.
>>
>> Just some ideas for different future ways to share
>> common aims and efforts....
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 07, 2012 at 06:28:11PM -0500, Dave Britton wrote:
>> > I've recently been struggling with carrot and coriander's
>> limited
>> > life support from being karmic-based, so a long-term support
>> > distribution would be fine with me, I'd vote for Debian or
>> Ubuntu
>> > just because I know it more and like the packaging system. The
>> most
>> > important aspect of puredyne for me is the real-time kernel
>> > implementation, so I may have to just learn how to roll a linux
>> > distro myself to get the latest RT. I'm working in
>> Supercollider,
>> > not pd, and I need jack and alsa to work well. I'd be happy to
>> learn
>> > more about broth, and the intricacies of packaging in general,
>> and
>> > help where I can.
>> >
>> > I also want to go on record thanking Aymeric and the rest of the
>> > team for bringing a great concept to reality and supporting its
>> > development for as long and well as you have. puredyne has
>> helped me
>> > a lot!
>> > -Dave
>> >
>> > On 02/07/2012 09:07 PM, Julian Brooks wrote:
>> > >>>Erm, now what?
>> > >>>
>> > >>>What is the general consensus of where to go next...
>> > >>>
>> > >>>I'm guessing that people are thinking of building on top of a
>> minimal
>> > >>>debian type thing?
>> > >>+1 for Debian :)
>> >
>> > ---
>> > [hidden email] [2]
>> > http://identi.ca/group/puredyne [3]
>> > irc://irc.goto10.org/puredyne [4]
>> ---
>> [hidden email] [5]
>> http://identi.ca/group/puredyne [6]
>> irc://irc.goto10.org/puredyne [7]
>
>
>
> Links:
> ------
> [1] http://live-build.debian.net/cgi-bin/live-build
> [2] mailto:[hidden email]
> [3] http://identi.ca/group/puredyne
> [4] http://irc.goto10.org/puredyne
> [5] mailto:[hidden email]
> [6] http://identi.ca/group/puredyne
> [7] http://irc.goto10.org/puredyne
> [8] mailto:[hidden email]

---
[hidden email]
http://identi.ca/group/puredyne
irc://irc.goto10.org/puredyne
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[puredyne] A way forward? [Was: Re: A New Install]

In reply to this post by Julian Brooks
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Thanks Julian,

your email got me thinking about the state of linux audio distro's and
the linux audio ecosystem, and this brought me to an idea of a possible
way forward for us, as former users of the dearly lamented puredyne.
Read on for a proposal of how I think we could move forward.

I should just mention that although I've mostly been a lurker on this
list, like many of you I've had excellent experiences of using puredyne
in media workshops and hacklabs over the last few years. I've been
reading people's comments here with interest.

On 08/02/12 16:35, Julian Brooks wrote:
> Obviously going to need a realtime kernel.  Are there really decent
> benefits from rolling your own to fit your own machine?  And again if so
> - how?

My understanding is that the mainline 3.x series kernels have integrated
most of the patches we used to have to apply ourselves to make an RT
kernel. So for most people, I guess the answer to your question will be
no, there aren't advantages, unless you have esoteric needs.

> Personally I would be well chuffed to have a lappy where pretty much
> everything is compiled and tweeked for my machine.  Not sure how big the
> performance gains would be but personal satisfaction-wise it would be
> sizeable.

Satisfying when it works, but easily broken and impossible to support,
from my experience. Of course, the greater your skills, the further you
can go with compiling your own software. This got me thinking about
empowerment (see below).

But the point about configuration and system tweeking is a good one.

At the moment, I can see several audio distro's with mediocre
distro-specific documentation. There are also documentation projects
that are not distro-specific, that have limited usefulness because much
of the content is outdated or will only work in particular circumstances.

I see an opportunity here for us to put the collective wisdom on this
list to work on creating a linux-audio documentation project, that would
be aimed at empowering former puredyne users to configure and tweak a
base debian system into something like puredyne.

This could include an editorial system to make sure that information
remained current and applicable to debian-stable. When each 'stable'
becomes 'oldstable', we could archive that set of docs and bring out a
new 'edition' specifically tested on and aimed at the new stable release.

I can see that if a group of us committed to start working on a wiki
now, with a view to releasing our first set of documents to coincide
with the release of wheezy (or as close as possible), a lot of people
would see the value of this as a unifying project, not another
duplication or derivative effort. I would expect we'd get a lot of
support from the debian-multimedia people, but our project would have a
different scope in being focussed on empowering people to make art using
FLOSS. And there would be plenty of scope for writing broth-like
scripts, automated installers and so on - but keeping everything
referenced to a specific base distro.

What do you all think about this? Would people be up for it? Or can
people think of other ways forward we should discuss first?

Mark
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---
[hidden email]
http://identi.ca/group/puredyne
irc://irc.goto10.org/puredyne
Julian Brooks Julian Brooks
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Re: [puredyne] A way forward? [Was: Re: A New Install]

Hey Mark,

Yip yip - in total agreement here.

Sounds like a whole heap of us are going to be doing this anyway, so lets firm-up[as in a crew].

Not sure how this will all pan out but I kind of like being in over my head. 

Could do with a project name at this point I reckon. 

Julian


On 9 February 2012 12:09, marker <[hidden email]> wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Thanks Julian,

your email got me thinking about the state of linux audio distro's and
the linux audio ecosystem, and this brought me to an idea of a possible
way forward for us, as former users of the dearly lamented puredyne.
Read on for a proposal of how I think we could move forward.

I should just mention that although I've mostly been a lurker on this
list, like many of you I've had excellent experiences of using puredyne
in media workshops and hacklabs over the last few years. I've been
reading people's comments here with interest.

On 08/02/12 16:35, Julian Brooks wrote:
> Obviously going to need a realtime kernel.  Are there really decent
> benefits from rolling your own to fit your own machine?  And again if so
> - how?

My understanding is that the mainline 3.x series kernels have integrated
most of the patches we used to have to apply ourselves to make an RT
kernel. So for most people, I guess the answer to your question will be
no, there aren't advantages, unless you have esoteric needs.

> Personally I would be well chuffed to have a lappy where pretty much
> everything is compiled and tweeked for my machine.  Not sure how big the
> performance gains would be but personal satisfaction-wise it would be
> sizeable.

Satisfying when it works, but easily broken and impossible to support,
from my experience. Of course, the greater your skills, the further you
can go with compiling your own software. This got me thinking about
empowerment (see below).

But the point about configuration and system tweeking is a good one.

At the moment, I can see several audio distro's with mediocre
distro-specific documentation. There are also documentation projects
that are not distro-specific, that have limited usefulness because much
of the content is outdated or will only work in particular circumstances.

I see an opportunity here for us to put the collective wisdom on this
list to work on creating a linux-audio documentation project, that would
be aimed at empowering former puredyne users to configure and tweak a
base debian system into something like puredyne.

This could include an editorial system to make sure that information
remained current and applicable to debian-stable. When each 'stable'
becomes 'oldstable', we could archive that set of docs and bring out a
new 'edition' specifically tested on and aimed at the new stable release.

I can see that if a group of us committed to start working on a wiki
now, with a view to releasing our first set of documents to coincide
with the release of wheezy (or as close as possible), a lot of people
would see the value of this as a unifying project, not another
duplication or derivative effort. I would expect we'd get a lot of
support from the debian-multimedia people, but our project would have a
different scope in being focussed on empowering people to make art using
FLOSS. And there would be plenty of scope for writing broth-like
scripts, automated installers and so on - but keeping everything
referenced to a specific base distro.

What do you all think about this? Would people be up for it? Or can
people think of other ways forward we should discuss first?

Mark
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---
[hidden email]
http://identi.ca/group/puredyne
irc://irc.goto10.org/puredyne


---
[hidden email]
http://identi.ca/group/puredyne
irc://irc.goto10.org/puredyne
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